SHIFTS/ INVESTIGATING SCORES IN PERFORMANCE ART PERFORMANCE AND EXHIBITION
curated by Katie Lee Dunbar and Anaïs Héraud as part of Month of the Performance Art Anthology 2015
Photograph by Ilya Noe
interview #2: John Court
Finland based, London born artist John Court. Court’s performances have captivated audiences worldwide at events such as 7a*11d in Toronto, Canada and DigitaLive Guangzhou China (2014) SpaceX Gallery Exeter in UK (2012) Guangzhou Live Art Festival in China, ANTI Contemporary Art Festival in Finland (both 2010), the Venice Bien- nale (2005) and the Liverpool Biennial (2004). http://www.johncourtnow.com/
For one and a half hours John Court performed the same procedure over and over again. After hanging a numbered sheet of paper on the wall he proceeded to mark off the numbers with a black marker. After each mark he walked to a chair to step up and over it before walking back to the paper to mark the next number. There was a deep voice coming from his pocket that counted in a slow drone. John performed this action until the task was completed and all of the numbers were marked off the sheet. I had the chance afterwards to ask him about his work.
Johanna: Because your score was so tight, I kept trying to find places of change or inconsistency–shifts within the pattern as it repeated. My attention was drawn to the details such as the place the pen hit the paper each time or how many steps you took from the paper to the chair. The most significant thing that I noticed changing over the course of the hour and a half, aside from the movement of the chair, was your physical state–the increase in your breath, the shift in your walk, your sweat etc. Would you be able to describe to me one or more of the states that you went through during the duration of the performance?
John: A lot of the performances I do are about being in the moment, but also kind of pulling up selective memories. It is quite literal what I did; it is very much about learning. But its not about what I did it, it's about why I did it. For me its all about being in that moment. What you said is really nice because thats what I go for. Every step is a different step. Every hit is a different hit. There are no two times the same. I supposedI am trying to understand the world physically. I am quite lucky to be able to be in this situation where I am able to do that through performance. The visual elements are not so important, it is about the action.
I didn't spend very much time in a classroom as a kid. I was always sent outside the classroom because I was always distracted. So for me learning through physicality was quite important. I didn't realize what was going to happen. I thought I would just step up and mark it, step up, and mark it...but then the chair started moving. I set up a really simple situation but it always changes in every performance. So I just keep myself open for that.
interview #2: John Court
Finland based, London born artist John Court. Court’s performances have captivated audiences worldwide at events such as 7a*11d in Toronto, Canada and DigitaLive Guangzhou China (2014) SpaceX Gallery Exeter in UK (2012) Guangzhou Live Art Festival in China, ANTI Contemporary Art Festival in Finland (both 2010), the Venice Bien- nale (2005) and the Liverpool Biennial (2004). http://www.johncourtnow.com/
For one and a half hours John Court performed the same procedure over and over again. After hanging a numbered sheet of paper on the wall he proceeded to mark off the numbers with a black marker. After each mark he walked to a chair to step up and over it before walking back to the paper to mark the next number. There was a deep voice coming from his pocket that counted in a slow drone. John performed this action until the task was completed and all of the numbers were marked off the sheet. I had the chance afterwards to ask him about his work.
Johanna: Because your score was so tight, I kept trying to find places of change or inconsistency–shifts within the pattern as it repeated. My attention was drawn to the details such as the place the pen hit the paper each time or how many steps you took from the paper to the chair. The most significant thing that I noticed changing over the course of the hour and a half, aside from the movement of the chair, was your physical state–the increase in your breath, the shift in your walk, your sweat etc. Would you be able to describe to me one or more of the states that you went through during the duration of the performance?
John: A lot of the performances I do are about being in the moment, but also kind of pulling up selective memories. It is quite literal what I did; it is very much about learning. But its not about what I did it, it's about why I did it. For me its all about being in that moment. What you said is really nice because thats what I go for. Every step is a different step. Every hit is a different hit. There are no two times the same. I supposedI am trying to understand the world physically. I am quite lucky to be able to be in this situation where I am able to do that through performance. The visual elements are not so important, it is about the action.
I didn't spend very much time in a classroom as a kid. I was always sent outside the classroom because I was always distracted. So for me learning through physicality was quite important. I didn't realize what was going to happen. I thought I would just step up and mark it, step up, and mark it...but then the chair started moving. I set up a really simple situation but it always changes in every performance. So I just keep myself open for that.
Jo: So one of the states that you enter in the performance is an experience of memory?
John: Yeah, I would say yes, but its not just that. I'm 45 so I have different experiences of different things. I just pull up selective memories. They are mainly memories of learning or of school experiences. I learned to read and write through making art. I kind of approach my work as a kind of learning. Or maybe its more like coping with life, coping with a situation that has happened.
Then you have the spatial elements as well, the physicality of the space. I didn't plan it but it was logic that that chair went over to that corner because I was moving in a clockwise direction. If I would have gone anti-clockwise then I would have pulled back time. My goal to be present, to be there then, is not going backwards. It is going forwards. Of course you can't help the memory from pulling up experiences. Even in the hand or the chest, an experience can come. I question repetition. What I do is never repetition. Its never the same. Always this moment is this moment, that moment is that moment. I could do that all my life, its fine. It's not what I do, its why I do it. You see it once and then you don't have to see it again if you don't want to. But the people were kind of there in this performance. It was a really nice audience. I could give and get from them. I don't look at them but there is an energy, there is a presence in them as well as me. From the child running around to someone sitting there for an hour...I could feel them. Mainly energy...I'm not looking socially. I am not thinking socially. Its just creative being.
Jo: It's interesting that you mention repetition because I was thinking, it seems that repetition is a tool that you use a lot in your work. Is that true?
John: I question repetition because it is different every time. I could have quite easily fallen off the chair...something could easily have happened, but its like my mind and my body become one. I know what I'm
doing. Even with the kid around. I can read his energy. I don't have to look. My mind and body kind of become one. It's difficult to explain. There are no words really, I don't think. I hope you kind of pick up on the energy that I am giving and the different states. Because sometimes I'm really angry, sometimes I'm really lost. But I'm not planning to do that. It happens. Maybe what I do could be seen as repetition, but the state that I am in is never the same.
Jo: That's a really nice way to bring it back because the title of this whole exhibition has to do with scores. So to me what you did looked like a very clear score, whether or not it was the same over and over again you do go to the paper, cross off the numbers, go to the chair, step over it, and go back to the paper over and over...
John: I don't understand “score”. They talked about Fluxus and all that, I don't know anything about Fluxus, but I have done a lot of things where I have produced some kind of image from a performance, like hour long text work that build up over the performance...they become beautiful artwork. And I've done stuff where I've had the idea, I've had the performance, and I've had the documentation. This one was different. I clearly wanted the pre- documentation to be the artwork. It was quite simple. I was just crossing off numbers. I didn't know whether I could finish because the time scale was a lot quicker than I wanted it to be but I just knew that I would be going really fast. The next one I do will be an 8 hour piece so I am curious to go back to that because the energy cannot be the same. At the moment, all I can think about is, What have I done? Why have I done it? This is what I do, I just open up to ideas and I just try to understand what I've done. In a way its like a shock. I don't know why it happens and how it happens. Is the paper an artwork now? I don't know. That thing is not a nice thing now. There is a lot of stuff inside it.
Jo: Thank you so much.
John: Thank you.
-interviewed by Johanna Gilje
John: Yeah, I would say yes, but its not just that. I'm 45 so I have different experiences of different things. I just pull up selective memories. They are mainly memories of learning or of school experiences. I learned to read and write through making art. I kind of approach my work as a kind of learning. Or maybe its more like coping with life, coping with a situation that has happened.
Then you have the spatial elements as well, the physicality of the space. I didn't plan it but it was logic that that chair went over to that corner because I was moving in a clockwise direction. If I would have gone anti-clockwise then I would have pulled back time. My goal to be present, to be there then, is not going backwards. It is going forwards. Of course you can't help the memory from pulling up experiences. Even in the hand or the chest, an experience can come. I question repetition. What I do is never repetition. Its never the same. Always this moment is this moment, that moment is that moment. I could do that all my life, its fine. It's not what I do, its why I do it. You see it once and then you don't have to see it again if you don't want to. But the people were kind of there in this performance. It was a really nice audience. I could give and get from them. I don't look at them but there is an energy, there is a presence in them as well as me. From the child running around to someone sitting there for an hour...I could feel them. Mainly energy...I'm not looking socially. I am not thinking socially. Its just creative being.
Jo: It's interesting that you mention repetition because I was thinking, it seems that repetition is a tool that you use a lot in your work. Is that true?
John: I question repetition because it is different every time. I could have quite easily fallen off the chair...something could easily have happened, but its like my mind and my body become one. I know what I'm
doing. Even with the kid around. I can read his energy. I don't have to look. My mind and body kind of become one. It's difficult to explain. There are no words really, I don't think. I hope you kind of pick up on the energy that I am giving and the different states. Because sometimes I'm really angry, sometimes I'm really lost. But I'm not planning to do that. It happens. Maybe what I do could be seen as repetition, but the state that I am in is never the same.
Jo: That's a really nice way to bring it back because the title of this whole exhibition has to do with scores. So to me what you did looked like a very clear score, whether or not it was the same over and over again you do go to the paper, cross off the numbers, go to the chair, step over it, and go back to the paper over and over...
John: I don't understand “score”. They talked about Fluxus and all that, I don't know anything about Fluxus, but I have done a lot of things where I have produced some kind of image from a performance, like hour long text work that build up over the performance...they become beautiful artwork. And I've done stuff where I've had the idea, I've had the performance, and I've had the documentation. This one was different. I clearly wanted the pre- documentation to be the artwork. It was quite simple. I was just crossing off numbers. I didn't know whether I could finish because the time scale was a lot quicker than I wanted it to be but I just knew that I would be going really fast. The next one I do will be an 8 hour piece so I am curious to go back to that because the energy cannot be the same. At the moment, all I can think about is, What have I done? Why have I done it? This is what I do, I just open up to ideas and I just try to understand what I've done. In a way its like a shock. I don't know why it happens and how it happens. Is the paper an artwork now? I don't know. That thing is not a nice thing now. There is a lot of stuff inside it.
Jo: Thank you so much.
John: Thank you.
-interviewed by Johanna Gilje
ABOUT THE EXHIBITION:
“Some scores* might be the core of the
performance, others are the remaining
traces. Sometimes they are material for
improvisation. Scores can remain private
and help to reach a certain state for the live
act, others might be artwork in them-selves.
Where does script end and the artwork
begin? What is the shift from concept to
performance?
We invite performance artists: Nathalie Anguezomo Mba Bikoro, John Court, Katie Lee Dunbar, Camilla Graff Junior, Leena Kela, Anaïs Héraud & Till Baumann; all of whom have developed a practice of score writing. Throughout the 19th of May the seven artists will share their methods and enter a dialog; showing visual, textual and audio scores as well as the relevant performances. *Event scores - instructions for a performance. Widely known as a result of the Fluxus movement.”-from the curators
We invite performance artists: Nathalie Anguezomo Mba Bikoro, John Court, Katie Lee Dunbar, Camilla Graff Junior, Leena Kela, Anaïs Héraud & Till Baumann; all of whom have developed a practice of score writing. Throughout the 19th of May the seven artists will share their methods and enter a dialog; showing visual, textual and audio scores as well as the relevant performances. *Event scores - instructions for a performance. Widely known as a result of the Fluxus movement.”-from the curators